Today, JAG interviews Amy Walls about her journey into financial advising and her work with tech and healthcare professionals. With over five years and 128 episodes together, Jag and Amy take the opportunity to reflect on Amy's "why"—the motivation behind her career at Thimbleberry Financial.
Amy shares that her early exposure to financial advising came from her father, who was a financial advisor until his passing when she was six. Although she initially strayed from the path, working in nonprofit management and fundraising, Amy became disillusioned with the inefficiencies she witnessed in the nonprofit space. This led her to soul search for a profession where she could have greater influence and deliver meaningful results. After years of self-assessment, Amy embraced her calling as a financial advisor, driven by a passion for empowering others with clear direction and support.
Amy specializes in tech and healthcare clients. and each group faces unique challenges. For tech clients, Amy emphasizes the complexity of equity compensation, tax implications, and the "noise" of unsolicited advice within the industry. These clients often need help navigating inconsistent income streams and making personalized financial decisions. In healthcare, professionals face challenges such as complex tax scenarios, underutilized employer benefits, delayed wealth accumulation due to extended education (and loans), and societal pressures to maintain a high-cost lifestyle. Amy highlights the importance of tailored financial strategies to address these multifaceted issues.
Amy's approach at Thimbleberry Financial focuses on educating clients, simplifying complex financial concepts, and creating plans that align with individual goals and values. Her team emphasizes trust, a judgment-free environment, and actionable guidance, enabling clients to feel confident and supported. Whether it’s saving a client from significant tax penalties, helping them navigate unexpected early retirement, or enabling tech clients to take self-funded sabbaticals, Amy finds deep fulfillment in making a tangible impact.
Amy concludes by sharing her ultimate goal for her clients: to feel confident, supported, and empowered in their financial journeys. Through trust, connection, and education, Thimbleberry Financial aims to provide clients with clarity and peace of mind, ensuring their financial plans align with their personal values and future aspirations.
ThimbleberryU 128 - Why Does Amy Do What She Does
Speakers: Jon Gay & Amy Walls
[Music Playing]
Jon Gay (00:07):
Welcome back to ThimbleberryU, I'm Jon Jag Gay, joined by Amy Walls from Thimbleberry Financial. Hello, Amy.
Amy Walls (00:13):
Hi Jag.
Jon Gay (00:15):
So, what's crazy, and I went back and looked, you and I have been doing this podcast together twice a month for over a hundred episodes, over five years now, which is really hard to believe.
Amy Walls (00:25):
It doesn't feel like it's been that long.
Jon Gay (00:27):
I think it's because we get along so well.
Amy Walls (00:29):
I agree.
Jon Gay (00:31):
And we thought it'd be a good idea for folks who have recently discovered the podcast who may not have gone all the way back to 2019, the before times when we started this podcast, to dig in a little bit with Amy about why she does the work that she does at Thimbleberry Financial, working specifically with tech and healthcare professionals. So, we're going to kind of dive in to talk about Amy's “why” today. Where do you want to start? Maybe the beginning?
Amy Walls (00:54):
That sounds like a good place.
Jon Gay (00:56):
So, what set you off on this path, Amy? Was there really a defining moment that started it for you or was it something you thought about for a while?
Amy Walls (01:03):
Interestingly, Jag, I said I would be a financial advisor up until about the age of 14 and we've talked about that my dad was a financial advisor and he passed away when I was 6. So, I had some experience with him back then. And being a financial advisor and back in the day he met clients at their homes. And so, a lot of his clients were older and wanted him to bring my brother and I along to appointments.
So, I got to see some of what the relationship looked like and that was cool. He also had some flexibility with time. But moving forward I realized I don't know what a financial advisor does, and in college I was a double major in, it's a mouthful, sociology and planning, public policy and management.
Jon Gay (01:47):
That is a mouthful.
Amy Walls (01:49):
Really, I was focused on nonprofit management and I went into nonprofit fundraising. While I worked for some really great organizations, I also noticed that some places I worked, there was a pattern. And mostly because nonprofits rely on volunteers-
And so people felt like, leadership sometimes felt like, we have volunteers here trying to help. They're setting some direction of what they want. If we give them any clear boundaries, we're not appreciating their help.
Jon Gay (02:23):
I see.
Amy Walls (02:24):
And then they're not going to want to help, so we don't want to turn that away. And what I saw continually happen is that there was conflict between what the volunteers then expected, and what the staff was able to do and the two things didn't align when there wasn't clear direction and leadership.
And I looked at that and I kept saying the people we're here to serve aren't winning, if there isn't clear direction in leadership, and I wanted to spend more of my time getting results for the people we served.
And obviously I was on the fundraising side, but I just said overall, this is something I would like more control and influence in. So, what do I need to be doing where the people I'm trying to help, I do have more of that control and influence and can be part of a bigger part of setting clear direction and leadership?
And I spent about two years soul searching, personality testing, trying to figure that out and everything said I needed to be a financial advisor. And I considered it off and on during the time. There were reasons I said no. And finally, I said, “This has just come up so much in my life that I need to take a leap and do this.”
Jon Gay (03:41):
So, in the old question of nature versus nurture, it sounds like in your case it was both.
Amy Walls (03:45):
Absolutely. I think that's correct.
Jon Gay (03:47):
Alright. Well, specifically, you work with a lot of clients in tech and healthcare. Those industries certainly have unique challenges. What are some of the specific financial planning hurdles or even opportunities that you see these two types of professionals face?
Amy Walls (04:02):
Jag, that's a great question. Let's start with tech. So, first in tech, many people experience equity compensation. We've spent, I don't know how many of our 128 episodes talking about this.
Jon Gay (04:14):
A few dozen probably.
Amy Walls (04:16):
Yeah. So, RSUs and non-qualified stock options and incentive stock options and ESPP plans, so all the things related to equity compensation. They're confusing; they have tax consequences. They play into what else you're doing. And so, understanding what to do and why and what to do with the stock in the end. These are big, complicated questions.
And in there I mentioned taxes. Obviously, there's a big tax effect. So, what we do definitely plays a role there with taxes. All of this kind of compensation creates inconsistent income, and inconsistent income is a little bit like living in limbo. And we could sit here and say, “Hey, it's great that puddles of money keep showing up-
Jon Gay (05:07):
But sometimes there's a drought.
Amy Walls (05:10):
Absolutely. Or sometimes then it's just confusing and overwhelming on, “What do I do to take advantage of this money>” And then the last thing that's quickly coming to mind for me in tech is the noise of others in the industry.
Jon Gay (05:27):
Oh yeah.
Amy Walls (05:29):
I think in this industry there's a lot of, you should be doing this; this is the best thing to do. There's a lot of self-proclaimed experts and in the tech industry, a lot of people are good at solving problems, so why shouldn't their financial lives be anything different?
And so, all of this I'm just going to categorize as “noise,” and what your industry and people in your industry tell you, you should be doing, or that you think you should be doing may not actually be right for you.
Jon Gay (06:07):
The analogy I would give is a lot of people who work in tech have, to paraphrase Liam Neeson, a very specific set of skills that people come to them for to handle certain things. And they should turn around and look for somebody who has expertise in financial planning to do their financial planning rather than sit around the 2025 version of the water cooler, be that Slack or Reddit, or wherever they are hearing, like you said, all the noise.
Amy Walls (06:32):
Yeah. The noise is dangerous and scary for sure. Talking about healthcare and what challenges professionals in healthcare face: One, complex tax scenarios. We've got high incomes in this area, oftentimes multiple streams of income, not just salary, but it may be things like bonuses or overtime and there's challenges, let alone consulting income that we see from many of our clients in healthcare.
Another piece is employer benefits. Navigating those benefits, especially for people in research or higher ed, healthcare, they may have multiple plans. 401(k)s and 403(b)s and deferred comp, and even HSAs, health savings accounts, all of that can be overwhelming. And sometimes we need to remember that not doing something, choosing not to do something, is choosing to do something.
Jon Gay (07:34):
You're still making a choice there. By the way, you said that HSAs can be confusing for medical professionals, I think that makes the rest of us feel a little bit better too.
Amy Walls (07:43):
Good. I'm here to serve. (Laughter) But all of that can result in underutilizing benefits. So, we want to maximize what we have available to us. Just like we talked about tech with equity comp. Additionally, for healthcare, there can be delayed wealth accumulation.
There's a lot more education required for many healthcare professionals. And so, they start their peak earning years later than others. And they may also have had more debt that they need to take care of. So, they have a reduced time horizon for compounding that wealth.
Jon Gay (08:16):
I'm glad you said debt because medical school student loan debt was in the back of my head the whole time we've been talking about this for sure.
Amy Walls (08:22):
Absolutely. It's a big issue for sure. Let's also couple that with expectations of the industry. Thomas Stanley’s book The Millionaire Next Door. I believe it was shared that doctors are the second highest earning profession in the United States, yet they are not the second wealthiest.
And there is an expectation within healthcare of keeping up with the Joneses. So, the industry alone pushes people as a culture to spend more than they actually need to, to be financially secure.
Additionally, allocation changes. There's a lot of details that go into balancing investments, rebalancing, building the portfolio, how much to save for retirement, especially with multiple plans potentially and then all the other financial goals that healthcare professionals have.
And so, do they have the time and bandwidth, mental bandwidth to understand how every component interacts with all the other components? It's kind of like thinking about how all different drugs interact, that's what financial planning is. It's a bunch of puzzle pieces and we've got to get them fitting together in the right way, so-
Jon Gay (09:38):
And this list of side effects isn't printed on the side of a bottle.
Amy Walls (09:41):
Yep. I like that. They also often may be challenged by protection gaps. There could be high income. Do we have adequate insurance? What do we need to worry about? What if I can't do my job as a surgeon? Those types of things.
Jon Gay (09:58):
Amy, your approach to financial planning clearly is resonating with your clients. Why do you think that is? What is it about the way you and your Thimbleberry team work that really connects strongly with those people that you serve?
Amy Walls (10:09):
Jag, that's a tough question. My approach and the Thimbleberry approach I think resonates with clients because it's designed to meet clients where they are, and focus on their unique goals. We emphasize education and simplicity, breaking down complex financial topics as best we can into clear actionable steps. At least that's what we strive for.
So, for tech and healthcare professionals who are used to being problem solvers and are used to connecting dots, we show how those financial puzzle pieces we just talked about work together. Things like the taxes and account types and investments so that they're educated and can make the right decisions for them with confidence.
So, me and my team also focus on building trust and providing a supportive and judgment free space. Many clients I know feel overwhelmed by financial decisions. It's how I feel when I go to the dentist. And they feel this way even though they're highly successful in their careers.
So, for us in working with a client, it's not about them knowing everything upfront. It's about them having a partner to guide them through the process and ensure that all those moving parts align with their values and goals. So, that connection combined with a plan that gives clarity and hopefully peace of mind, I believe is what makes the difference.
Jon Gay (11:38):
That makes a lot of sense. Amy let's shift gears and go back to your personal journey here. Have there been any moments in your work where you stopped and thought, “Yes, this is exactly why I do this?” I'm sure there's many, but can you come with a couple examples?
Amy Walls (11:51):
Oh yes. A client needing to retire unexpectedly for health reasons. And one client needing to do that is one thing, but when you think that there's a couple and the other person still is going to need to retire, they're going to need to have assets for that after protecting their spouse or partner in the health challenges they're having and what that means from a cost perspective is important.
And when we help them figure out how to now experience and do some of the things that they thought they'd be doing a lot later, that's absolutely why I do this.
Another thought is, anytime one of our tech clients takes one of their self-created sabbaticals. Something we've talked about in a prior episode, that's just awesome and exciting that they can take that break and take care of themselves.
Another thing that comes to mind is the other day I was working with one of my paraplanners on a strategy for a client and they were new to us, so that's an important piece of this. And we found errors from the prior year before we knew them, that were going to continue into the current year. And all in all, by pointing that out and as long as they fixed it in time by the deadline, we're going to save them almost $30,000 in taxes.
Jon Gay (13:16):
Holy cow.
Amy Walls (13:16):
In tax penalties. So, all of those reasons are why we do what we do.
Jon Gay (13:23):
That makes a lot of sense. Amy, something we've talked about again in many episodes of the podcast is that it's easy to fall into myths or misunderstandings about money, especially when you're busy with a demanding career in tech or healthcare, not to say everything going on in your personal life as well. What are some misconceptions people in these specific industries tend to have about their financial futures?
Amy Walls (13:43):
Jag, we touched on this a little bit earlier, so I'll try to be more explicit with it because It's subtle. Many tech and healthcare professionals assume that because they're smart, skilled, and great at connecting dots in their work, they're naturally going to be just as effective at managing their financial lives.
And while these traits are really valuable, financial planning involves a unique set of complexities. Like we've talked about, the taxes, the account types, investment allocations, they all interact and when you move one piece, the others can all shift. So, you have to understand how the cogs move and what the impact will be in order to avoid unintended consequences.
Jon Gay (14:28):
To give you a little bit of a parallel here, I've said this before in the podcast, my wife Ellen is the smartest person I know. She is crazy smart, works at a large company, does a lot with business and spreadsheets and up and down the whole thing. We had to upgrade our devices over Thanksgiving. She got a new phone, and I got a new iPad. And she hates dealing with this stuff. She says, “You deal with it.”
Amy Walls (14:52):
I love Ellen.
Jon Gay (14:54):
She is more than smart enough to handle this stuff, but she's like, “This stuff hurts my brain. I don't want to deal with it. This is what I have you for,” and of course there are a million things I have her to deal with that I just can't stand dealing with.
She's so darn smart, but she wants nothing to do with the specifics of upgrading a phone and to do the software update and all that kind of stuff. So your point is certainly well taken. You might be really innately intelligent, and you might have a really great skill set at certain things, it doesn't mean you're an expert at everything.
Amy Walls (15:22):
Absolutely. I'm not an expert at everything. I'm really good at what I do. I am not an expert. I'm really glad my husband handles my tech for me at home, the office-
Jon Gay (15:31):
You can relate to Ellen, and I can relate to Mark.
Amy Walls (15:34):
Yes. So yeah, to your point, a common misconception is that high income or stock-based compensation guarantees financial security. So, one thing to recognize is if all the pieces aren't fitting together, we can end up with inefficiencies, over exposure to risk or really just missed opportunities that it's hard to quantify the cost of.
Jon Gay (15:56):
Alright, we're going to get into our feels for this last question, Amy.
Amy Walls (15:58):
Oh gosh, Jag, the feels.
Jon Gay (16:01):
The feels, all about the feels as the kids say. What do you want your clients to feel when they work with you? You can be in your “Feels Era” here.
Amy Walls (16:11):
Okay. Confident, supported, and empowered.
Jon Gay (16:14):
I like those.
Amy Walls (16:16):
They should feel like they have the clarity around their financial choices based on the education we've given and trust in the process that we go through together to know that their future is handled. It's really important to me and my team that our clients experience peace of mind knowing that their financial plan reflects their goals and their values. So confident, supported, and empowered, for sure.
Jon Gay (16:43):
I like those three. So, we talk all the time. We even talked in our last episode about needing to know the why to properly handle your financial future. You need to understand why you're doing certain things. So, I think it's been really great today to hear more about your backstory and the why behind your work.
I mean, it's clear that your passion for helping people secure their future goes beyond just the numbers. I mean, if you listen to any episode of the podcast, you can tell that for sure. Connection, trust, truly making a difference, all so important to you and your team. And if one of our listeners wants to talk to you and your team at Thimbleberry Financial, how do they best find you?
Amy Walls (17:14):
They can find us online at thimbleberryfinancial.com or by giving us a call at (503) 610-6510.
[Music Playing]
Jon Gay (17:22):
Great stuff, Amy. We'll talk again soon.
Amy Walls (17:24):
Sounds great, Jag.
Jon Gay (17:26):
Securities offered through registered representatives of Cambridge Investment Research Inc, a broker-dealer member of FINRA/SIPC. Advisory services through Cambridge Investment Research Advisors Inc, a registered investment advisor. Cambridge and Thimbleberry Financial are not affiliated.
Discussions in this show should not be construed as specific recommendations or investment advice. Always consult with your investment professional before making important investment decisions.
Securities offered through registered representatives of Cambridge Investment Research Inc, a broker-dealer member of FINRA/SIPC. Advisory services through Cambridge Investment Research Advisors Inc, a registered investment advisor. Cambridge and Thimbleberry Financial are not affiliated.